FHP – Ep. 6 – “How To Stop Bed Wetting & Accidents” feat. Dr. Steve Hodges, MD

FHP - Ep. 6 - "How To Stop Bed Wetting & Accidents" feat. Dr. Steve Hodges, MD

Dr. Barter talks with Dr. Steve Hodges, MD, pediatric urologist, from Wake Forest University about the surprising cause of childhood bed wetting and accident and how to fix it.


Intro [00:00:03] Welcome to the Fearless Health podcast with host Dr. Ann-Marie Barter. Dr. Barter is on a mission to help people achieve their health and wellness goals and help men and women live their best lives fearlessly. Dr. Barter is the founder of Alternative Family Medicine and Chiropractic in Denver and Longmont, Colorado.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:00:24] Thank you so much for joining us here at Fearless Health podcast. I’m your host, Dr. Ann-Marie Barter. And I’m so excited today. I have Dr. Steve Hodges, who is a pediatric urologist at the Wake Forest University, who has published several books on Bedwetting. He has a website called BedwettingInAction.com and primarily specializes in that. So I’m so happy that you’re joining us today. So thank you so much for being here.


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:00:52] Thank you so much for having me.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:00:54] Well, I’m excited to get into this because I think that this is something that a lot of parents. Really are concerned about and struggle with, so tell me as it relates to bedwetting accidents and toileting trouble. What do you think is causing some of this?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:01:16] So I think staff are saying that, you know, this is you can find a lot of different opinions online. That’s the tough part. I think the internet’s been really good at opening up information to people, but it’s been hard to kind of tease through what’s real or legitimate. And then even in all legitimate sources, if you were speaking to just pediatricians or urologists, there’s some debate. I, of course, think I’m right, but I think that I can make a good case for it. And so in our field, they will put bedwetting in one category because of it. You may know this obviously, Mona symptomatic children, your sister bedwetting with no other symptoms, and they’ll keep that distinct from their wedding while away with bedwetting or having poop accidents like that. And I think it’s all about radiation. I think that. There are rare cases where some people can have accidents while awake, and not you can get into why that happens. But in general, if your bladder is being more overactive, you need your bladder squeezing when it shouldn’t. Just a tiny bit of that wedding yourself or sleeping because you’re unconscious, you can’t wake up and go to the bathroom if that progresses, gets more attractive than you might have a child that’s running to the bathroom during daytime while awake. And then obviously, they’re going to accidentally pee on themselves while awake. And then as that progresses, and we’ll explain, you can actually get back since we’re good by your side. And our research points the fact that children develop that bladder activity as a result of basically delaying pooping the colons not designed to kind of hold poop as opposed to kind of move it through and let it out. If you pile up a bunch of poop at the end of the colon, which a lot of kids do. It gives a bladder hiccups for lack of a better term, and it starts having ActionScript. And the trickier part of that is that not everyone. Other people have genes that makes the bladder very subtle of it, so it gets a little bit more complicated than just not pooping, but that’s the basic idea.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:03:24] So the big bottom line is that a child being constipated is really probably the trigger for the onset of maybe the bedwetting or the accidents at school or whatever else, whatever else, there’s an accident. Is that correct?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:03:42] Yeah, I think and I think it gets even trickier in terms of using the word constipation, because it’s such that everyone defines that differently. So I think that’s what I used to because it’s it’s the simplest term. But what we’re really saying, because a lot of parents say, Well, my kids and I watch better every day, I would say is if your child’s putting off pooping at all, then they probably have this problem. And if we to look at it into the child’s having access to have something going on, it’s not like normal being a parent. So. So I wouldn’t ignore it. That’s my main message is don’t ignore actions. Don’t wait for kids that. If you have a child that’s potty trained and having access, get them evaluated. You’re more than likely find a problem. It might be the most common cause, which is a group issue. It might be something more more significant like know neurologic disorder and common problem, and all that gets ignored. If you just say, well, you know, accidents are normal. So it’s been a difficult our practice is getting parents and even other physicians to act on incontinence because my doctors say, well, it’s normal to wet the bed till five or six or seven or whatever. But we believe that it’s never normal, and I think we have good evidence that we’re right.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:04:52] So if a child is potty trained and then suddenly they revert, let’s say, in school to pitlane or to having two accidents to the same rules apply. Does it come back to constipation for you or potentially a more serious problem like a neurologic disorder? How do you work that particular symptom out?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:05:16] Yes. So statistically speaking, it’s most likely the conservation issues. So I, you know, there’s lots of different causes we learn about, but when you really distill them down to things, you see, it’s either neurologic. And so I work that up out of the kitchen of an office with Max, and I’ll take a look at their spinal cord, you know, if their spinal cord appears normal and we know how to look at that. But typically speaking, your gluteal collapsed or what you called by crack should be straight up and down. Go straight to the spine. There should be no dimples or hairy parts or anything funny there, and that’s all normal. Then they’re usually neurologically normal. And then there’s one other condition and boys that can cause it. It’s an anatomic blockage in the urethra called urethral valve, and they usually come with really worsening problems like worsening accidents or get infections. And so a simple test like an ultrasound, which most doctors get can rule that out. So once I’ve ruled out the neurologic and the anatomic issues, then it’s almost always the poop and I’ll take an X-ray and usually document that right.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:06:24] And people are pretty backed up. I mean, I would say most parents believe that their child is not constipated. I think I’ve seen that as a general rule. Oh, no, my child poops. Every day they ask their kid, Oh, do you go to the bathroom every day? Yeah, yeah, poop every day. So how are you able to tell a parent to make like signs and symptoms to look for for constipation?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:06:49] Yes, we have a really good resource on our website, bedwetting and accent wsj.com, which has like the time of constipation. I usually ask the family, other people, OK, and sometimes I get lucky and say, Yeah, you know, the kid or the mom assumes that every day. And then she says, I don’t know every so often. So then I have a good end to get the topic started. But if everyone there says we feel completely normally, I think even if I give them possible signs, I’m not going to convince them to get an x ray. And then we look at the x ray together and then they always feel awful, like, Oh goodness, I don’t know there at all. It’s pretty impressive. But some signs that we see that might not be typical or, you know, large bowel movements. If you have a really, really large album, which is the most common one we see, then that’s not normal. So that means you’ve been withholding it and you’re kind of letting out this huge, you’re delivering a baby and then you have multiple small bowel movements, you know, that’s just letting a little bit off at a time, sometimes intermittent diarrhea and constipation where you’re having a hard ball and then loose or kind of leaking around belly pain. All these signs that I remember, I had a mom say, You know, my my child, I know when they need to poop because I had a tummy hurts. I’m like a second way too late. Hence should be feeling the urge to poop, not having a distention of your whole bowel that makes you feel sick. So you really get deep in the conversation. I think you can. At least my patient, I can tell you they have these symptoms, I can convince them, but if I can’t, I just get the x rays and often it helps. I don’t feel like.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:08:24] OK, great. And. What do you feel like is contributing to this? I mean, because bedwetting is pretty common, you know, at this point of or having accidents. What do you think is contributing to just say, the constipation, since that’s what you think is the big common trigger for this and what the research has suggested. So what do you believe is the reason that we have such an epidemic of constipation?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:08:54] I thought just kind of evolved on this, and I think that I think modern society in general is not conducive to kids pooping because like a lot of processed foods, obviously low fiber content, their structured environment where they’re like in clothes. And I mean that that is like if you lived to, I don’t know, thousands of years ago, you would just be out in the, I don’t know, in the fields naked and you would be eating whatever whole foods that promote and you wouldn’t have no reason to not poop. So I think it’s a combination of just kind of restrictive bathroom policies. Maybe early training because kids, you know, they learn these things are more and they don’t know why they’re using it. Know they can’t let stuff out. But honestly, I think it comes down to genetics and personality. Like, some kids are more prone to constipation and others even on a good diet. Some people of like a better term and they have that personality trait. And I think it’s just like an evolutionary kind of malfunction. You know, we’re the only animal smart enough to put off pooping, I think. I don’t think any other animal thinks of it. And it’s a it’s a problem which you smartphone get.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:10:07] Right. I think you mentioned something earlier. I mean, and I totally agree with you, I think our diet is really a huge problem and I think probably the structured school schedule. But you also mentioned potty training may be too early. What’s a what’s it? What age range should parents really start to do that, because I feel like parents really want to start early and get their kids ready for preschool or school to be potty trained? They feel a lot of pressure to do that. So do you have recommendations of when a good window is to start to do that, then?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:10:44] I’m of two minds. This one is that I see all the problems I see are or happen after my training and in there, and they happen as a result of a child holding or delaying too much to me. No hydrangea. Bad thing. So I would put it off as far as I could. On the other hand, though, a lot of kids can get trained and withhold, and if they don’t have the right genes, then they do fine, right? Generally speaking, they’re not going to have accidents, even though they may not feel great that they’re full of poop. So I’m not too dogmatic about it anymore. But I do think that child has to know kind of what they’re doing and be on board because it’s easy to teach a very young infant to kind of just withhold. But that’s very different than learning to go when you need to get timely fashion. So in general, I think between the ages of three and four is the ideal time because you can kind of communicate a little bit and know what’s going on. They know they need to go. And then it becomes kind of socially an issue if you’re four and I go to the bathroom. I know a lot of preschools will limit access for three year olds, and I think that’s wrong. I think because a lot of kids aren’t trained at three and they’re healthy and normal. So I think. Most kids, I say, OK, maybe at three, start introducing it if they’re not trained before, that’s a problem, but it probably takes care of itself in that year. And I would as a mom, you know, be pretty proactive in terms of defending that. You know, I’m sure if a school is not letting you go there, they probably can be convinced to allow it for a three year old.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:12:13] Yeah, yeah. Good advice. And you also talked about we’re talking about constipation, but is this really an IBS issue because you’ve talked about diarrhea constipation? Is this like basically IBS with constipation or irritable bowel with constipation primarily? Is what you’re seeing with this? Or is this just straight? These kids don’t have time to go to the bathroom. This is not a syndrome, it’s just they need to be given more time and more fiber.


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:12:44] That’s actually very interesting because I think that a lot of older patients with IBS probably had the problem I’m describing as infants or children, and it never got addressed. And so that’s why they have IBS. So I think that the colon, the end of the colon, the rectum starts off in a normal size and it’s the sensing organ. And if it was working normally, it would fill with poop. You would feel that and you would go poop because there be no reason not to allow it. But since the patients we see are so prone to kind of withholding, so then they turn the rectum into kind of a storage organ. They have poop stored at the end of their colon. The ability of that defense force then is decreased because it can only stretch so much, and the ability to squeeze to empty is decreased because it’s so stretched out. So then you have this hard to kind of piled in here so that there’s softer stuff going by that might come out easier. But then if it’s hard, you have to strain to get it out. So I do think that it’s basically a. A creation, a behavioral problem at the beginning, at least, a physiologic problem that then can present later as IBS. And so and most of the time, there’s nothing else going on in the food allergy. There’s no issues. It’s just that if the child is who spent time, they would be fine. They get in. So then you need to restore normal function by emptying it out.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:13:59] And yeah, absolutely. And if this doesn’t, if this problem doesn’t get addressed when they’re young, what long term ramifications can these patients expect to see, potentially as adults if this doesn’t get straightened out?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:14:16] Yes, that’s that’s going to be a little bit speculative, but we know that most accidents go away eventually. Right. And I think that’s part of the reason why physicians are less likely to treat WEDDING. because they say, Well, you know, if you just wait long enough goes away. And that is that is true. About 25 percent of five year olds have accidents and then it gets better and it gets better pretty rapidly. So they divide and then but then it gets better about 15 percent a year just for bedwetting. So there’s a little bit slower. And so you can have a lot of older kids still having action. So that’s one reason to treat it. And the other is to treat, as we don’t know, really specifically what this hugely dilated can do to somebody as an adult. We knew it causes can cause voiding dysfunction in adults, so issues with bladder control even in later ages. That’s been that’s been proven scientifically. I have a theory about IBS pain with intercourse or interstitial cystitis. A lot of other neurologic conditions we see that deal with a pelvic floor dysfunction can be more prevalent. So I just think in general, we can’t define it specifically if you’re going to have that problem or not. But in general, you know, you want the body to be working like it’s intended to kind of work like it’s supposed to. And so to have a hugely delayed colon can’t be a good thing. You know, long term, you want it to be working like it was designed.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:15:35] Yeah, absolutely. And do you see anything with pathogenic bacteria? Do you see anything with parasites, fungal overgrowth? Do you see any of that as a contributor to potentially the constipation, a.k.a. the IBS? Do you see any of that, these patients?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:15:56] Well, I’d say that a couple of things started off when kids get withholding started early on, it’s either like with changes in diet, so they’re going from formula milk or formula to solids or introducing something as rice. You’re also changing the consistency, the poop. But also, it’s common after diarrheal illness. So if you have diarrhea, if the regular poops, you get diarrhea and then it gets firm, they can have that happen. And also after antibiotics so early on, they could get some antibiotics that kind of disrupt their bowel, maybe their microbiome or whatever gets them some disturbed bowel movements like diarrhea. And then when they get home again, it can present itself so, so on. On the front side, I think disrupting that can cause a problem start. And then if you withhold. Chronically, and you get to kind of poo piled up in your rectum. That’s been proven to change the microbiome of the poop and to make it actually more virulent for DCI. So the kind of stuff that lives there is that it’s going to cause more aggressively and we definitely see more UTIs and girls that have a physical. So I think on both sides. And that’s one debate we get into. A lot of doctors concern parents about, you know, what’s the safest laxative to use it? There’s no good way to kind of clean up the colon without washing out some of the bacteria that’s supposed to be there. And I do think that probiotics can be used after cleansing to kind of repopulate it, but we’re definitely disrupting the microbiome by withholding food and also by cleaning it out. So I think it’s tough.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:17:31] Yeah, you definitely see the dysbiosis of, you know, the the gut flora, for sure. And so you’re cleaning this out. I mean, I think that that’s how you feel like it’s really important to to restore tone. And I’m totally on board with you. I agree with you 100 percent and I feel the same way I’ve been able to clean up a lot of old school utilize in other issues, bedwetting by actually treating the gut, which is interesting. But I would also say so you’re starting to do this based on enemas, laxatives, like how are you going about potentially cleaning this out?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:18:12] So I try to cater to what the families are comfortable with, if they’re in, if it’s a motivated family and the child child’s old enough to understand that this is what’s going on and they want to get better than I do push and I’m going to start off with. I think it’s the best way to get the end of the call and what I’m concerned about empty. But there’s no I’ve essentially I’ve been doing this for a while now. There’s no like perfect. Solution, right? I’ve done a lot of osmotic laxative, like more like I’ve done a lot of stimulant acts as now like Ex-Lax because I talk a lot of GI doctors and they’re pretty comfortable using those in high doses. And I’ve done a lot of enemas and I think enemas are best, but every kid is different and not every enema is perfect. And I do think. I am agnostic in terms of how they get empty, I’m happy to use anything that works. But you do need to check to make sure they’re getting empty if they’re not getting better. So I really shortened the amount of time that I wait to see if we’re getting better. So because a lot of people, at least in my in my field, will say it’s going to take years to resolve. I really look for progress within a week a month. And if we’re not seeing differences in x ray, if they’re available and then modify the program, if they’re not getting empty because you would be amazed at how much it enemas and lax. Have I given a kid and their X-ray looks different in like Boston?


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:19:28] Wow. And are these I mean, in in a kid like that? I mean, how severe are their symptoms or is it does? Is it graded? Like, does it matter how constipated they are to how severe their symptoms are? Have you seen a correlation to that degree or no?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:19:46] No, it’s good point. They’re just kind of fall, basically. And the interesting thing is when I look at the x rays and I’ve we’ve published, this is the proof is piled up in two places, primarily one is the rectum and one of the right colon. So it’s not usually the whole colon I make sense to my brain explains that way that they hold the poop suppository. And obviously, but then it probably messes up a pair of peristalsis like downstream and then the right column, which is, turns out, not normal. You’re not sick of me. And so that’s what we see. But I can have a kid that’s just wearing a bad rap kid, you know, wetting the bed, peeing himself, or they can prevent themselves, and the x rays can look similar. So I haven’t really been able to say if they’re this dilated is worse. I basically say, You’re having accents, OK? Are you dilated? Yes. And go from there. And attention to that, and this must be just how people made their ginger different, some KGB really backed up and just have good vaccines, right? That’s usually my last symptom. We’ll see with their wedding as well. So I have no bladder symptoms at all. And now the kids will have their wedding day wet and poop actions in terms of severely constipated. But I tell everyone, and I’m a believer, that when you’re pooping on yourself, that’s kind of end stage that you’re at, yours backed up. If you’re going to get and it makes sense because poop was just falling out of control, it literally got off the guy. Yeah.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:21:09] And I want to make sure we make this point clear, you know, because this is a lot of patients or moms or whatnot listening to this. And so I think some people are going to say, even though this makes sense to you and I, how is being backed up in your colon going to cause accidents? Would you mind just talking about the anatomy a little bit and how that’s creating and causing that?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:21:37] Yeah. And so this is, you know, I’m trying to. I didn’t fully understand this even when I started, right, so because they are teaching and it would take hours to explain, like all the theory behind it, but what so way back when, like am I? When I was a baby, they thought the kids had a blockage. If they were peeing on themselves, they thought they had a hard case of this, or had parents complained about this or bring this up. People still come in asking for this therapy. They thought there was a blockage in the urethra and that you would just dilate and stretch out the bladder neck and they get better. And anecdotally, that had some benefits, and you can talk about why that may have helped. And then they but they had no standardization about how often or how much you stretch them out. And then they started saying, Well, you know, this blockage we’re seeing, it’s probably just a muscle that the kid is squeezing when they should be squeezing. So they said, you know, they have a additional bladder function and they’re peeing the trying to hold it in and messing things up. And so the standard of care has become biofeedback, and there’s probably still a role for that. But the more I’ve gotten into this, I realize that the bladder is. But just a side product of the calling function so that Blatter sits in front of the colon or the rectum, and that that’s of the spinal cord and the nerves that run from the top or to the bladder that control bladder function go right around the rectum. So my theory, and I’m pretty sure this is right, there’s nerves when they’re stressed. You get the response. And the best example of this would be Dr. Regan’s type, where he basically did a great in the 80s. He took kids with dilated rectum and did it aerodynamics, which is a bladder test to show overactive bladder. And he proved that they had bladder spasms and they shouldn’t have them. Then you clean them all out, made their rectum normal and redid the urine and your lungs. So we just took that finding and extrapolated. It says that if you can, if it can cause activity when you’re. So anything that can cause it when you’re awake and kind of dark, that’s all kids. And I used to think that these kids are constipated and they get this nerve response, which I explain sometimes is like a real estate problem, like you got all this poop that isn’t really set. That’s really not what’s going on. It’s more of a nerve issue. But I thought that they have that problem. And they also maybe don’t pee on time because every mom says they come in and they were just waiting last minute to pee wee twice meant to pee. But I’ve had a few kids that were like, I couldn’t get them empty or whatever, and I couldn’t get their colon fix. And so, you know, they say, Oh, my medicines are miserable and I’ve just Botox, which is a whole nother discussion. But I put the toxin, the bladder and their habits completely normalized, completely normal. So this and that, combined with the fact that if you have a kid, it’s peeing on themselves. You would think that making them more often would help pee every hour, every two hours, and that never help for me. I realize this is not even a bladder issue. Once the bladder is working okay, the kids do find it just like we do it to the signals coming out of the blue and with high urgency from the colon. And that model is the only thing that fits everything I see, because if you have this colon doing that, the kids can’t pee on time. They rush the bathroom. But when you get rid of it, the symptoms go away. Not only that, but if I was able to block this signal immediately, like I do if the signals go wrong. And so all the behavior component is really, I think, overblown and I’ll go the parents, I’ll say, you know. Go home and try to find yourself like hold your pet or so it’s impossible because the urge is so great, like your body makes you go to that. And so only when that’s thrown up out of whack because have action


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:25:18] and in generally most of the time you are not having to do Botox injections again, this is coming really down to obtain the colon to stabilize the nerve roots.


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:25:29] I’ve got like a four step thing I fall through and no one is about and I work on it. And some people, you know, they don’t have the finances, the resources or the ability to get. It’s a big deal to buy and to administer enema every night to kids. And even if we did the mere letch program, that’s a lot of work. And some parents, kids don’t have the resources to do that, so they don’t have that. Then I’ll go through some oral meds that are an option. They’re about 30 percent effective or not great. And I honestly think they’re just not good at blocking the nerve and they talking too much better. So I’ll offer that if a kid is having a rough life and having access and their parents can’t treat them the way we want, and I think that’s a good way to kind of at least resolve the symptoms temporarily, and it does make them very happy.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:26:18] I want to talk about some of the misconceptions. A lot of folks believe that if their child is wetting themselves, it’s a psychological problem. Can you speak to that at all?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:26:31] Yeah, that’s really. I think that’s a great point. Two things we have to make sure we make clear, and I don’t know how to do that better than discussing in our podcast or shouting from the rooftops. But kids do not typically have actions on purpose, and there’s a pretty significant abuse problem with that. I think it’s a major cause of child abuse, and I’m on like a Google news alert and I get all the abuse reports related incontinence and I get one every weekend. If you search the news, you would see like trials of child abuse and even murder of parents who were fed up with having children having access. So for us to have that going on this day and age, I think the big failing on the part of physicians and society in general. So if we get the message out that kids aren’t having access on some provisions, it’s not their fault. That would be number one. Number two, I think it’s really overblown. And I see this online too that if a kid’s having was dry and they start having access that they’ve been abused or sexually assaulted, which I’m. I get that kind of stuff happens, you should take it seriously and make sure, you know, but that’s by far the minority. Most of the cases are they went to school and they just didn’t like going to school because it was embarrassing. The bathrooms are dirty and you tell the people they start having accents. So while I do know that sexual assault happens, whatever the cause of the child withholding, whether it was dirty bathrooms at school does not want to go to bathroom or it could have been assault. The cause of the bladder of activity is withheld poop, and that’s what she got to address while keeping all the other stuff in mind. But I don’t want a kid to be classified as abuse child just because they started having actions. That’s definitely not correct.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:28:12] What a great point. That’s a great point you bring up. So. What do you feel like are a couple things that maybe parents need to know or couple take home tips that parents can take home with this today? Anything?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:28:31] I think no one would be if was having accents, don’t explain it away, childish, uncontrollably teeing up the abandoned self, there’s definitely reason and that that’s probably what I’m talking about, but it may be something else and you’re not going to get it worked out. You don’t let anyone tell you what to say or they’ll be dry when they want to. It’s peeing and pooping. Normally, it’s like a physiologic process, like sleeping or walking or crawling. You don’t have to teach your kid to do these things. They did them normally. And so if they’re not doing it properly, so the could not abstain continent, you would feel like you would if a kid wasn’t walking, especially with an issue. And the other is that. Don’t lose track when you potty train their bowel habits. You want to. Keep track of this because one of the bathrooms you have, it is an open discussion, you want to have topics on their diet, you know, you want to know what they’re eating, you know, if they’re being asked if you want to know what they’re doing being the only time it gets kind of tough is early on us because of, you know, like, for instance, what is an all about movement? I think it’s very debatable, and I don’t even know if I want to do a study like the breastfed infant. When are they getting backed up, if they are? Because it can be normal for them not to for a while, but once a child’s on regular diet, it really should be going every day. So. The problem we see is this kind of back up of the poop sneaks up on people. And so the best thing I can say is just be aware, you know, be attentive. Look for subtle things like we discussed, like large bowel movements threatening to poop. And then don’t be afraid to treat them when you see it and treat aggressively in early.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:30:07] Great. And do you believe any of these kids need behavioral therapy, is that necessary?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:30:15] I don’t really think so, I think. Some kids say one of the side effects of not training early is that you get kids that just are happier pooping and peeing and pushups, and that’s something that, you know, I think it’s a problem only because we make it a problem. It’s not like they would be seven or eight and and pull up because they would eventually peer pressure would get to them. But there are some kids where you have to. I had this experience where you’re getting, you know, Patty Griffin and corruption almost four, and you’ve got to get them on a toilet and get to be a little aggressive and lift weights to get that fixed. And then there are some pelvic floor training that I think are not the sole way to treat these problems, but can help because they’ve learned to tighten these muscles and maybe learn to relax and develop maybe some core strength and some. Learn how to empty after maybe a month, two years of holding the same position or position changes that can be taught, you know, to sit on the right way in a party with the feet elevated and so forth. Some simple stuff, but I definitely don’t think there’s like a psychological condition in 86. Typically in this, it’s more of a test kitchen, the right way to go. It’s great, you know, it brings up a good point, you know, autistic kids are children on the spectrum, have a high incidence of this condition. A kid with ADHD have a high in this condition. But those conditions don’t cause it right there, disassociated so vivid kid on the spectrum or with ADHD, they’re more likely to have these problems. But just putting them on Ritalin or whatever doesn’t fix the problem you fix there. The ADHD there on that or you treat that and then you address things that to the same way we’ve talked about for other children.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:31:59] Right. That’s those are great tips. Anything that I didn’t ask about that you think is important to add.


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:32:08] I think there’s a lot of debates on May relax. You know, you probably hear about that, you know, whether I’m safe, I don’t know about any because for us, like if if a kid comes in, she’s my youngest is an example. She she was normally pooping in the shower right here, right? And so I’ve seen too much of this stuff to let that sit. So I just started relax and she did fine. And so we use a lot of me relax because it helps kids go. It’s tasteless and Pokemon, it works. But, you know, people are worried about it. I would not treat a child for constipation just because you don’t like your life. I would find another. Legitimate therapy, so I see a lot of people online struggling to get their kids to poop because they don’t want to use milk, but they don’t like ask their doctor for Laslo, so they don’t use like a magnesium supplement. And I mean, like a magnesium, a real therapy because there’s a lot of low levels of magnesium. If you want to use something like magnesium hydroxide, this actually makes you poop something that if you took, you would poop, right? There’s lots of things that the treat kids. And so don’t don’t be afraid to treat them. And then if you don’t like me, relax, just find something else that’s physician could prescribe or tell you about or our website, Tavon, to get them moving.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:33:25] What about one, the controversial topic of colon hydrotherapy? What’s your take on that?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:33:33] Yes, a lot of people are talking about that. I think. Again, anything that gets a common theme, all hope. But you have to get it empty daily and have to stay empty, so a lot of people will say, you know, can we get my charges cleaned out once and then we’ll be gone kicking them out? But then they wouldn’t like to put in a hospital and put a tube or nose and clean them out. But then they would go home and they would prove again to fill back up so they wouldn’t know that. So people seem to have to like the idea of going there, and it makes them feel like it’s maybe a healthier way to do it. But honestly, the less dwell time with the liquid in the colon, the better, because you could put anything in the colon really short term, like we have some animals that you just tap water and they are safe because the water goes in and flushed out. If you irrigate a tap water in the colon over long term, you would cause health issues with sodium levels. So I can’t speak to how therapy. But if it was done with an isotonic fluid, meaning a fluid that was bound for the body theoretically should be awesome. If it helped them get empty, then so be it. Probably just time inefficient.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:34:36] Right? Yeah, great. Well, where can people find you if they want to get in touch with you?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:34:43] Oh yeah. So this is exciting because we have a website bedwetting and access dot com. And since I’ve been treating these accents, I’ve gotten more and more dysfunctional consultation questions like, Hey, my kid is six months old, they can’t poop, and there’s so little information about that. We’re actually going to have a new book coming out a three month therapy called Mop. I’m going to pre mop and actually come out this fall so open to help those parents of kids before these accents will develop and kind of cut down on the issues in the future.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:35:13] And can you talk about the names of your books? Because I know you’ve written multiple, I read It’s no accident, but can you also name the other books because they’re great?


Dr. Steve Hodges [00:35:22] Oh yeah, so we have it’s no accident, which is, I think, 2012, and that’s when we first discovered these issues. And Dr. Regan’s research, who’s the guy that kind of pioneered this? And then we came out with the bedwetting and accents Dr. Fault, because we were seeing so much blaming of the children, like we talked about abuse issues that we wanted to make sure the kids and the parents knew that this was an accidental thing. And then we came out. We don’t really own the rights to it. So actually, because it was a publisher and so we wanted to get we modified a lot of our therapy from this direction to the modern day to put out the mom. The book, which is my stance for the modified a Regan protocol, is a Regan was seeing just bedwetter as pretty much because she was a nephrologist. You kind of go into this accent because it was wearing the bed. And when we got into seeing, you know, severe cases with, you know, years and years of access pmpa, we found that his short program, which is just three months, was not enough. And so we modified it a bit. We also have a couple of fun books. We have a gentle giant who just give us a rhyming book to get used to talking about poop, and then we’re coming out with them the premium of this fall, and they’re all available on the website. So awesome.


Dr. Ann-Marie [00:36:34] This has been great information. Thank you so much for joining us here today. This was fantastic and sharing all your knowledge. If you want more information about our podcast, please check out Fearlesshealthpodcast.com And if you like what we’re doing, please share it with your friends. Write us five stars and leave a comment below. Thank you so much. Thank you so much for listening. If you enjoyed learning with us today, please give us a five star review. Comment like and share our podcast with your friends and family. As always, if you’d like to learn more information about today’s guest, please head over to Fearlesshealthpodcast.com for links to their site and other educational resources.

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